On the bit vs on the contact

Katherine F · Well Schooled

On the bit vs on the contact

spirithorse · Advanced

On the bit is a description of how the horse appears
Contact is the amount of pressure the rider applies to the bit

Janet B · Yearling

In both cases, the horse must be moving from the hind end toward a consistent contact on the bit.

I'm not sure I would say it's the amount of pressure the rider applies to the bit, but rather the amount that the horse moves into the contact while the rider stays soft and steady.

Also, on the bit, I think of as round and on the contact I think of as round or a nose out stretching out.

-- Edited by Barnmice Admin on Tuesday 19th of October 2010 04:28:14 PM

equipoize · Foal

I tend to avoid Both phrases. I will say 'on the aids' or 'connection'. On the Aids makes it clear that it is more than just pulling the reins - it is a complete circle of aids, given and received by the horse to improve the horse's over all posture. Connection instead of contact makes the rider think about having a conversation with the horse (a telephone connection) or having an electrical circuit flowing through - an electrical connection.

While it might seemthat this is just semantics, the choice of words a trainer uses will really influence the rider's subtle preceptions of what is desired.

Queenrider · Advanced

On the bit is the first stage toward true collection and requires the horse to move into the steady, soft contact on the outside rein, provided by the rider. Think of this as 5 lbs on the outside rein and 2-3 lbs on the inside rein. If there is more weight on the inside than the outside then the horse is leaning and needs a half halt and/or the rider is pulling and using the reins for support!
On the bit is a change in posture required by the horse but also by the rider. The rider must be "on the bit" before the horse can be on the bit. If the rider doesn't have a correct seat (ear/shoulder/hip/ankle in a perpendicular line to the ground, seat bones equally weighted) then the horse will not be able to achieve the rquired posture. It is the equivalent of a human coming to "attention" in the military sense.
The best way for the rider to learn this is on a horse who already understands "on the bit". I have found many starting riders do not recognize the beginnings of on the bit from the horse and they do not reward the horse for this behaviour so the horse gives up.It can be very tentative and very short for the first few tries from the horse.

-- Edited by Queenrider on Tuesday 19th of October 2010 12:02:53 PM

DressageLeggy · Yearling

I don't like to think of either having anything to do with the rider pulling, or holding, or applying any force to the rein - it all comes from the horse.

Having a bit in the mouth is a foreign experience for the horse and a horse who has learned to "accept the bit" is one that has generally acknowledged the bit is not going to hurt them. To force the horse's head down by pulling is to counter this. So instead we ride the horse forward from the leg, in balance with our own bodies and allow the horse so seek the bit.
The rider's elbows should never move back behind their body, nor should they come out away from the body - this is pulling. Rather the rider should begin by shortening the reins to a point where there is a feeling with the mouth and enticing the horse to establish a connection with the bit - after they have learned to seek and accept it. Now that the horse can comfortably round his body through a forward motion into a contact with the bit he is said to be "on the contact". This is such that he allows the action of the riders soft, giving and taking hands to "bow" his back while still seeking and accepting the bit.
Both horses who accept the bit and the contact will allow lateral flexion. Horses who are on the contact allow longitudinal positioning.

-- Edited by DressageLeggy on Tuesday 19th of October 2010 07:57:32 PM

Puzzle · Foal

My 2 cents. I have always had difficulties to get a horse on the bit. I now have a young horse that is naturally on the bit due to his conformation. However because of my constant "wanting him on the bit" he began to poke his nose. Not a pretty site, making me "try" (pull, saw, and jab) even more. FF - New trainer, told me to leave the front, completely which made him poke even more. After 3 weeks I asked her, how long are we going to run around with his head in the air? Her answer - "how long is a piece of string?" OOOOKie Doookie! Somehow during the same week he started dropping his head (no talk of contact) for a few strides on an off. Now another 3 weeks later HE OFFERS to work on the bit and into a steady contact - (something he is showing me and giving me the feel) for about 1/4 of the ride. The rest of the time he is still poking. But I have now learned to concentrate on rhythm and my position and just have enough length of rein to steer whither/shoulder and keeping my hands at the whither position. It might take another "piece of string" for him to be able to have the strength to offer the contact all the time but LEAVE THE FRONT and it will happen like magic. Best of all, my rides are so much less stressful for both of us! (but very stressful for hubby who saw a nice pic before when I was pulling him down vs the nose in the air now, so you must be strong in your mind that for now you are not going to impress the masses, only a very, very few really knowledgeable eyes) PS, all my previous trainer was telling me to play-play, sponge, half-halt and so on - perhaps I just didn't understand them but none of that worked for me. Not sure this is answering the question except for that I think as a previous poster said, it comes from the horse, not the rider, if you do the "other" basics correctly.

Laura F · Well Schooled

Great story, Puzzle!

There is a strong urge to fiddle with the mouth to get the horse on the bit, when really everything should come from behind, and, as you say, it should come from the horse!

Katherine F · Well Schooled

I also hear the term "between the aids". How that does fit in? Is there a difference between that and "on the aids" or are they interchangeable?

spirithorse · Advanced

{Think of this as 5 lbs on the outside rein and 2-3 lbs on the inside rein}

This is what is wrong with riding with the hands. The weight should be measured in ounces rather than pounds. Pick up a five pound weight in your hand, would you like that pulling on your mouth.

"ON THE BIT" represents the appearance of the head/neck in relationship to stage of training. It does not represent the rider pulling on the bit/bits to 'force' the head/neck carriage.

{If the rider doesn't have a correct seat (ear/shoulder/hip/ankle in a perpendicular line to the ground, seat bones equally weighted) then the horse will not be able to achieve the rquired posture.}

The image of the position described is actually in contrary to the requirements of the horse.
The image herein is a correct seat/leg position [saddle to far forward] for the pelvic to be neutral and the seat to balance

-- Edited by spirithorse on Monday 1st of November 2010 03:20:38 PM

spirithorse · Advanced

{I was taught that inbetween the aids simply met having the right contact with the right aids for the movement and without excess pressures.}

I like to reference it as the time between applying the aids for different movements. In other words, ask, release let the horse follow through, then ask for the change.

-- Edited by spirithorse on Monday 1st of November 2010 03:24:31 PM

Horse-hearted · Advanced

I feel that the reins are communication lines- you should be have a conversation with your horse through them, not a wrestling match.
And yes, before all, it comes from the engine! Everyone wants the "on-the-bit" look so badly they forgo the nesassary communication. Dont' sacrifice good riding for a pretty picture!
Riders: Start with the seat, move on to your legs, follow up with your hands. Oh, and where are your eyes? No one said it was easy!

spirithorse · Advanced

Eyes in the direction of travel, and to both sides and rear looking for those horse eating critters from nowhere land. LOL

sedonasilver · Advanced

hahaha so true, spirithorse, so true! The horse eating critters in my arena like to hide behind the barrels we use for jumps.

Horse-hearted · Advanced

Love it. There is always a "spooky" side to the arena.

spirithorse · Advanced

Every day is a new spooky day for my mare. Something new is added, or moved or whatever...it is a reason to 'play' the game............lol

Horse-hearted · Advanced

And such a fun game! With new and improved reactions!

spirithorse · Advanced

Yes, but the game makes life soooo interesting. I would never try remove this thing from my girl cause it is part of her character.

Sidney · Well Schooled

Excellent posts everyone.......Puzzle I can relate to your experience as that is totally me and my girl LOL! I started to do the same thing as you.....I just let her head alone for about 3 weeks and am just now starting to pick up the reins again. I am trying to be way more soft in hands and elastic in arms.....not so easy for me but we are making some progress! smile

-- Edited by Sidney on Friday 5th of November 2010 12:11:40 PM

Horse-hearted · Advanced

H aha my coach used to tell me to let go of my Hercules arms- I totally know where you are coming from. It's a long hard road.
Love your picture, by the way, Sidney!

spirithorse · Advanced

Just imagine the horse is your dance partner,,,,,,,STOP pulling and lead instead