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Post Info TOPIC: Repeating a training exercise that just isn't working


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Date: Feb 19, 2011
Repeating a training exercise that just isn't working
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Do you sometimes find your self asking your horse to do something, he doesn't do it, you ask the exact same way - no response- you continue to ask the same way, but maybe stronger - still no response?

I have to always remember that if something isn't working, I need to change things up a bit. Sort of like exmplaining something to a person who doesn't understand you.
Change the way you say it, rather than sasying it louder! ;)

What kinds of mental cues do you have in place to make you try something different?

-- Edited by Barbara F on Saturday 19th of February 2011 11:44:41 AM

-- Edited by Barnmice Admin on Sunday 20th of February 2011 03:03:51 PM

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Date: Feb 19, 2011
RE: Repeating a training excercise that just isn't working
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My philosophy, after over 4 decades of riding, is if by the third time I apply the aids the horse does not respond--I am doing something wrong.  It does not matter if the same aids worked the day before, the week before, the year before or the decade before, if they don't work today they are wrong for today.
The possible reasons for this "disobedience" can be endless, for instance the horse may be sore, the horse may be getting sick, or possibly the horse may decide that the regular aids are too brutal and that he is just not going to cooperate any more.  This did not become clear to me until I learned I have MS and realized that my MS had been messing up my body my whole riding life.  Then I realized that I had started off my serious riding "career" by punishing my horse for MY inabilities and MY mistakes.  Since then I have learned to ask for my horse's active cooperation and thus have sometimes been able to get results that are WAY BEYOND my current riding ability.
The interesting thing is that when I time my aids accurately to the horse's movement AND make my aids as light as possible I have much more success, and I can repeat this success until I mess up my timing or make my aids too hard.
But that is just my experience.  A non-handicapped rider may get different results. 

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Date: Feb 20, 2011
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Most of my training experience has been with dogs, but I think training horses is not a lot different (aside from obvious physical differences of course). What I have seen over and over again when humans train animals (and I do this sometimes too), is that humans often don't manage to make it clear to the animal what they want. Sometimes even the human doesn't know clearly what they want, or they can't manage to get the animal to even partly do the desired behavior (therefore can't effectively reward the animal), or the animal performs, but the human doesn't reward, or rewards too late (poor timing), or the animal does it, but the human doesn't repeat the signal the same way the next opportunity. Animals actually do try to figure us out, and they are very good at doing that, but if it's not working, 95% of the time the human has screwed up somehow. In many cases even a trained horse would have trouble performing for a non-trained person. So  you can continue bumbling along, trying to figure out what works for you and your horse, which will take longer and maybe be more frustrating, or you can consult a trainer who can probably shorten that road considerably. Basically it's the human who needs instruction, dogs and horses already have their people figured out, they already know how to be a dog or a horse.

-- Edited by Marlene on Sunday 20th of February 2011 01:08:16 PM

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Date: Feb 20, 2011
RE: Repeating a training exercise that just isn't working
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Hi, Marlene:

I'm in complete agreement.  I often find when coaching that the horses are completing the exercise well, or relatively so, and that the riders are either unaware, or they move the goalposts just as the horse offers them the best answer.  Changing the demand just as an animal achieves success is discouraging, and confusing...I think that allowing animals to enjoy success before moving on to the next requirement is imperative (the same can be said for riders).

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Date: Feb 21, 2011
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The definition of insanity is supposed to be doing a behavior and expecting a different response the second time.  WHY would the rider ask the exact same way.  Horses answer affirmatively (in greater or lesser degrees) when the rider asks at the right moment with progressively introduced aids.   Asking 'stronger' is rarely necessarily, but rather differently.

As far as the basis for different cues.....balance, simplicity, breaking the reaction/exercise into more simple bites.


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