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Post Info TOPIC: Just a thought on Training


Foal

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Date: May 9, 2011
Just a thought on Training
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Albert Einstein once said:

“Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.”

I am in Ontario, booked for a one-on-one with a lady for a couple of hours. She wants to work on laying her horse down. I call to confirm the date and time, she confirms and then says, “So, you will teach my horse to lay down while you are here, right?” I am a bit taken back. I have never met this lady or her horse; I have no idea if the horse even walks on a lead. I have no way of knowing what either is capable of. I am pretty certain that two hours is not enough time.

This is something I run into on a regular basis. People seem to think their horse is a four-wheeler. Leave it in the garage for 6 months, then get on and expect it to be perfect. When we teach an animal something new, it is not a package like a suspension system. We do not just bolt it into place and tear off.

People think in a linear fashion and horses do not. Linear is a direct line, if I want to walk to the door I go straight to the door. Horse wants to walk to the door; it will cover the entire area and get to the door when it gets there. They are not on a schedule.

People have a bad habit of blaming the horse when things do not go well. “I came in last in the class because my horse acted up.” It is not the horse’s job to set the pace, it is ours. If our horse does not do what we want when we want then we have not done our job. Horses are horses, sometimes they will be off, and this is the joy of having a horse versus a four-wheeler.

We have to learn to set up our horses and ourselves for success. If I want to do well at a show, I work at it prior to the show; I work at it at the show and always in a calm fashion. I don’t worry if everyone is watching and my horse is not right on the money. I tend not to go to the shows anymore because I hate seeing people punishing their horses. People are whipping with their reins, laying on the spurs or crop, yanking on the bit. I just cringe: for whatever reason the horse is not right, neither punishment nor anger will fix it. We must stop what we are doing, figure it out and make it right. This is what Leaders do, unless they are the Canadian Government.

I often wonder if people would be so quick with the whip if it was a 2 to 5 year old child. That’s about the mental ability of the average horse. Yes, they are much bigger than a child, but we don’t expect more from large children than we do from small ones. Inside that huge head is still just a small child’s brain.

Nor do I agree with treating my horse as a big cuddly teddy bear or projecting human characteristics on it. A horse is a horse and that’s amazing enough. Don’t read human emotion into them then get mad because they respond as a horse.

We set our own destiny, and that of our horses, the least we can do is put forward the effort. I often hold demonstrations working with difficult horses; I get a huge response as the horses I use for demonstration get a free hour of training. But many of the people who wanted help with their horse choose not to attend if their horse isn’t selected for demonstration. I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but many times it is not the horse that needs the training, it’s the owners. Be proactive, get out there and learn. There are so many ways to get information – really, there are no excuses.

Not all horses are created equal: 90 % of horses will respond in a way referred to as “normal.” But about 10% do not respond to “normal” training. This does not mean the horse is no good, it means we have to change to help the horse become what it needs to be. This is no different than the school system, set up to teach the masses. But what about those kids that are just a bit different? Do we throw them away; blame them because they cannot learn like all the others? Horses are no different, some just don’t learn like all the rest. Beating them will not make them learn, getting frustrated will not help. We must learn to step back, be honest with ourselves and assess the situation for what it is not what we think it should be.

In closing, the message I am trying to get across is rather simple. Train your horse with your head, not your emotions. Be calm, persistent, consistent and assertive, always. Treat your horse with respect, but treat it like a horse. When things don’t go as planned, don’t blame your horse. Step back, reassess, and do it again and again till you both get it.

Gord Searle

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Grand Prix

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Date: May 9, 2011
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Thank you : )

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"....there is no normal life, Wyatt, there's just life..."



Grand Prix

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Date: May 9, 2011
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As Justice said.. thank you for that :) Very true, wise words. A great reminder to all who seem to forget that a horse is a horse, not a human, despite what anthropomorphic qualities we seem to give them.

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Date: May 9, 2011
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Yes thank you, especially for pointing out that the standard training methods don't necessarily work for every horse.

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Date: May 9, 2011
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yes thank you for pointing out that one approach does not work for all horses.
and  reminding that A horse is a Horse and responds like a horse - not a dog, cat, human or budgie

 

I would challenge you on one point though - that a horse's mind is like that of a 2 - 5 year old - we do not an can not know what another creature knows.  Or rate it's intelligence on a human level -- a horse is not human, nor are we horses.

our intelligence is different - really - I have found in my experience if you treat an animal as just an animal - it distances itself from you - and you can not truly know it - if you treat it as another individual with respect for its particular species traits and tendancies - but also as an equal - it opens up and you will be astounded at how it strives to communicate and how it behaves...and how much it truly is another individual

We expect a heck of a lot from our domestic animals - so to say they show this level of intelligence...or that..is not really just.



-- Edited by Goatgirl on Monday 9th of May 2011 03:41:49 PM



-- Edited by Goatgirl on Monday 9th of May 2011 04:32:47 PM

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To Ride or Not to Ride? What a stupid question


Foal

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Date: May 9, 2011
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I have met many kids 2-5 that were very smart and I have also met many an adult that were rather slow.  What was intended was to keep all things in perspective.  Just because a horse is large does not mean that we need to be rough.  Just because a kid is 2, we do not need to talk to them like they are idiots.

Hope that helps.



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Date: May 9, 2011
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yes. thank you for clarifying -- yes. I agree completely

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To Ride or Not to Ride? What a stupid question


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Date: May 9, 2011
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I leaned to ride in the Northern Virginia hunt seat system. In this culture it was always emphasized that horses were horses, and not pets or humans. The horses were ridden, and then turned out and allowed to be horses for part of the day and stalled for the night in winter and daytime in summer. Treating your horse like a dog or a teenage girl love-object was greatly frowned at. Good riding, good feed, good stalls and bedding, good grooming and sane training were valued, not your horsie playing with you and acting like you are a long lost friend.
Of course these people (hunt seat) looked down on me. My first horse was an angel from heaven. He actually cooperated with me (a beginner) and did not seem to mind being around me. I never had to take feed with me to catch him when everybody else had to use feed to catch their horses. But I did with him as the culture said, good riding, feed, pasture (when I could) etc.. No playing. Well, I did play in a way, I tried to ride well enough so my horse enjoyed being ridden by me. He often seemed to enjoy the trail rides.

Thank you for speaking horse truth.


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Foal

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Date: May 10, 2011
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For those of you that are interested, here is a link to a video of me working with different horses during trailer loading.
Face Book:
http://www.facebook.com/video/video.php?v=10150178690552311&oid=131978341862
Youtube:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p5mlkoU2JQw

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Yearling

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Date: Sep 25, 2011
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VERY well said!

I also help people. I am not as talented or skilled or with as much experience as you, but I usually help with traumatized, wild or 'ill tempered' (I find usually the owner is the ill tempered one) I work with horses and teach little things such as halter breaking, spook busting. But have also helped people to teach their horses tricks in a more fun and natural way, sometimes even useful tricks or tricks for a dressage test like a 'half pass' using no force, just clicker training. I am surprised how many people say 'It takes longer than I expected' or 'Oh they don't understand' And I stand there and think...we have had one session...of not even 20 minutes and you expect miracles?

It does make me wonder sometimes!

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Date: Sep 25, 2011
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Put on a blindfold and learn to feel the horse!

We use our eyes and then we have to think rather than 'feel' the communication link between horse and rider.



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Ask and Allow, do not demand and force



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Date: Sep 26, 2011
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Oooh! Can I watch when you do that?

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Date: Sep 26, 2011
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Try it, you just might learn something....and yes I have done it.......



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Ask and Allow, do not demand and force



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Date: Sep 27, 2011
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Beat you to it! I have ridden without my glasses (I'm extremely nearsighted), and yes, I DO ride differently without them.

I see well enough to avoid big things like walls, but completely lose the ability to use visual "clues" (cannot see a bulging neck muscle, for instance). The experience increased my sensitivity. Some day I may try to ride a test sans glasses -- but the bystanders'd need a warning. "Here comes Mrs. Magoo! Gangway!"

It was a BHSI instructor who first suggested removing my glasses many, many years ago. She was a very insightful , sensitive and creative instructor.

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Date: Sep 27, 2011
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I applaud you Figarocubed.
I have incorporated eye masks into my schooling of clients in order to allow them the opportunity to feel the horse. It does sharpen their senses....LOL

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Ask and Allow, do not demand and force



Grand Prix

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Date: Sep 27, 2011
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When I was taking lessons in a riding school, the instructor used to make us go over the jumps with our eyes closed to get a better feel. I used to peek at bit, I'll admit!

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Date: Sep 27, 2011
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Hold your applause.

I would never blindfold a student. There are safer ways to teach feel. Have the student look up at the rafters, shut their eyes momentarily, as Barb F's instructor did, use Sally Swift's "soft eyes". Lunge line lessons would be a safe and appropriate time for riding with closed eyes, but not blindfolded or masked. Riders who wear corrective lenses can, if they choose, ride without for the experience. It worked for me, but my eyes are quite poor.

Some people get distressingly disoriented riding without sight, even momentarily. It's not for every student. For those who are willing to try it with eyes closed, I'll lead their horses at the walk. That gives them the chance to feel the swing & sway of a walking horse with little danger. If, after that, they feel emboldened to try it at trot or canter with eyes closed for a few strides in a safe environment, that's fine.



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Date: Sep 28, 2011
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Closing the eyes is enough, no blindfolds (because some people get dizzy).

However if you lliterally want to 'reset' the brain to the feeling (this was proven by Eckart Meyners) have the rider look all the way over the right shoulder and all the way over the left shoulder as they are changing their body actions.  It DOES work well!



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Date: Sep 28, 2011
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If I place eye shades on a rider, I ALWAYS am at the side of the horse with one hand on one rein in case of trouble.

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Ask and Allow, do not demand and force



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Date: Sep 29, 2011
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Still, Bad Things can happen even with your hand on a rein. Horses spook or bolt and situations can go from bad to catastrophic in less time than it takes to whip off a blindfold.

I like Eckart Meyner's "reset" idea much better. Thanks, Barnfrog, for mentioning it.

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Yearling

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Date: Oct 23, 2011
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I had an acquaintance many years ago when I was in college that was (and still is) blind and she used to ride and jump like a person that could see. Watching her ride was one of the most remarkable and impressive things I have ever witnessed. She did patterns beautifully. Granted, she only rode in the arena and only had three mounts at the riding school that she rode. And don't ask me how she did it, I am not capable of fully understanding how she and her instructor got her to that point. Of course, she lived blind and was already accustomed to using her other senses, which isn't the same as temporarily taking sight away from a seeing person in a lesson. I can't imagine inhibiting sight in a seeing rider in any way that they can not quickly restore their sight in a pinch. To each his own, but safety first! :)

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Yearling

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Date: Jan 2, 2013
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Amen.

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