Horse grabs bit and runs!!!

porte101 · Yearling

Horse grabs bit and runs!!!

spirithorse · Advanced

Hello

Not a big problem. First and foremost, do not pull on the bit when he grabs it, instead rattle the bit...make it rattle in his mouth then take a soft hold and release some of the hold. If he does not pay attention rattle the bit again taking a firmer hold and then releasing some of the hold......

In other words, give a take.....take when he does not listen, give when he listens.

porte101 · Yearling

okay, now what bit should i use besides the western curb? and how can i get him to keep his head down without keeping tight reins on him?

spirithorse · Advanced

As for the bit, well I start reschooling horses in simple snaffles, because they rattle very easily. Get him to respond in a simple snaffle before you consider going beyond that.
As for his head down, that would depend upon what is causing the head to come up. Rattlin the bit usually will bring the head down, however, remember you really want the poll always as the highest point and should always be above the withers.

porte101 · Yearling

Thank you! I will try all of this and hope that it works on him.

spirithorse · Advanced

Most welcome, remember patience, trust and respect.

Geoffrey Pannell · Well Schooled

What sort of saddle are you riding in? It sounds to me like the horse is in some discomfort, check to see that the saddle fits properly before you start 'rattling' the bit at him. Can you post some pics of him in work so we have a better idea of what's going on? Is the horse an older one or a youngster?

Barbara F · Grand Prix

Hi there,

Lovely looking horse!

I agree with both Spirit and Geoffrey.

FIRST have a professional check his saddle SECOND have a vet look at his teeth THIRD have a chiropractor or massage therapist check his back and neck. When they run so consistently like that, even with a curb in their mouths, they are usually running from SOMETHING.

Once you know your horse is free of pain, find a small area to ride in. Somewhere he can't get going, but not so tight that he'll fall.

It may be as simple as the horse running from your tight reins and the pressure of the curb. Have you tried "giving" on the reins for a few strides at canter to see if your horse will relax? I would try that first.

You can also practice very lightly vibrating the reins. This is hard to explain to someone, because you only want to vibrate and softly move the bit in the horse's mouth to try to get him to relax and chew. No jerking on the reins.

The MOMENT he even slightly gives, you give. Talk to him and get him softly chewing at the walk and trot. Now quietly ask for canter. Squeeze softly on the reins and give, scratch his neck, squeeze softly and give, scratch his neck. Almost like massaging his mouth. The whole thing is done very lightly and it's during the "give" part that the horse will relax - not during the squeeze part.

Do you know how to do a half-halt? If so, you can do one every few strides in rhythm. For every half-halt you do a mixture of squeezing, slightly vibrating the reins and GIVING.

As a matter of fact, do you have a coach or experienced person who can help you with this? I realize these instructions are very complicated!!

-- Edited by Barbara F on Saturday 9th of July 2011 09:58:41 AM

Marlene · Advanced

I agree with previous suggestions. Have you tried setting him up where he can't go far, say only several strides before he meets a fence (since it is difficult to find a pen with a small turning radius), so he doesn't have enough room to get up a crazy speed before you bring him back down. Or have someone working him on a lunge line while you canter/lope him. How does he canter on a lunge line for you, if you have tried that. If he lopes nicely on the line (with and without saddle), but bolts only when you are mounted it might indicate an equipment problem or teeth, as opposed to a training problem such as reins too tense, or your balance too far forward or back. Are you aware of how you are handling the reins when you ask for a canter/lope, i.e. are you tensing up expecting he's going to bolt, and he's therefore prepared for a fight right from the start. If this is a longstanding habit, going back to lungeing and slow progression might seem like a backward step, but it also might retrain what is a bad habit and may be necessary even if you find a physical problem. So just fixing a saddle or tooth problem might be necessary first, but then you might also have to retrain his habit till he learns that he doesn't have to anticipate pain, and that takes time to unlearn old habit, establish new habit.

porte101 · Yearling

Geoffrey, I had a vet checkup about 2 weeks ago and he was fine. the picture of health so pain shouldn't be a factor. i ride in an all-purpose saddle that is partially forwarded to train for jumping. and it fits him like a dream. and ill try to get a picture on here, oh and he is 5 years old.

Barbara F, thank you, and there's nothing wrong with his back as far as the vet is concerned and his teeth are floated and painless, he has no pain from anything that we know of and riding in a smaller pen really helped so thank you again on that, giving on the reins also helped as i concentrated on my hands and legs for a bit and he was really nicely going, still fast, but not crazy and not flying

Marlene, he goes nicely on the lunge line mounted with someone on the ground and me in the saddle and free lunging he is perfect, its when he sees an open field i guess his mind clicks to run, and as i told Barbara F, concentrating on my hands really helped so thank you all for the suggestions

Queenrider · Advanced

http://lindatellingtonjones.com/horseAnnouncements.shtml

This is the TTEAM wesite. Go down past the announcements and there are several helpful things to try on the right hand side.

http://www.ttouch.com/shop/index.php?productID=213

You might want to try a Balance rein as well. I have used this on the hottest of horses and it can function as an emergency brake at times once the horse is trained in it.

http://www.ttouch.com/shop/index.php?productID=214

The roller bit is also a good bit to try for difficult horses. It looks awful but it works well and horses love it. The roller makes their mouth wet and soft. Ihave used this bit many times over the years for retraining purposes.

Barbara F · Grand Prix

Glad you are making some progress. Keep us updated!

Nikki Salo · Grand Prix

Great advice from everybody!

I'll toss in my 2 cents. From a western point of view, I don't like to put a horse in a curb bit unless it is going very well in a snaffle. It is more of a finishing touch, so like suggested already I'd go back to a snaffle if you have one. If you're riding in a curb you really want to be in tune with your seat and leg aids, and your horse needs to be in tune with them as well.

A good exercise that I like to use on young horses and horses that need a refresher in stopping (and slowing down) is riding a large square starting at the working trot. I like to set up cones or some sort of marker, but you don't need to if you don't have any. The exercise is pretty straight forward, working trot to the corner of your square, ask for a stop first with your seat then your hands. When the horse is stopped, back up 4-5 steps, pause then walk to the corner of the square, pivot (or just gently turn if your horse can't pivot off of leg aids yet) and repeat. When you have this going pretty good at the trot, you can replace the trot with a canter. I really like doing this exercise because I find that it helps the horse to slow down and get thinking, and it also helps the rider to use leg and seat aids which gets you and the horse in tune with transitions and stopping, which are both created from behind.

I'm sure there will be more good advice coming your way :)

barnfrog · Advanced

Ok, a lot of comment. A horse cannot pull unless the rider participates in the activity, but the question is why he runs in the first place. Looking at the physical development of the horse('s neck) is shows underneck development. So, this means reschooling, teaching the horse to chew/to follow the hand/to seek it. Do NOT shake a curb bit in the horse's mouth, esp a horse which is above the bit; it will only punish the bars. Sure, the horse will 'back off'/likely not pull, but it will also be too shortened in its posture and become tense.

When we look at the pix of lateral work you should be sitting in the middle not off to the inside, and a LITTLE lateral flexion is ENOUGH to allow the horse to work into the outside connection. And when ridden 'in position' the rider gains 'control' of tempo and the horse quite easily. The question (from looking at the pix) is how centered and quietly you sit when asking for canter. Are you following/allowing bascule (telescoping) of the neck in walk and canter??? Lack of that alone tenses a horse oftentimes, and the lack of following also causes the bars to be hurt, and then the horse just inverts and runs if the rider does not act in a fashion to prevent this.

So, as to canter (lunging him has NOTHING to do with the calmness for the depart per se): What aids do you use? Just touch for a depart stride or trot him faster into a depart?? Gather the horse/slow the tempo instead. IF a horse is too low, then it HAS to raise the head to depart, so better balance before. Obviously if you are riding in a shanked bit, there should be minimal tension (and reins in one hand). So likely there are no half halts being use.

For a horse to bit down on the bit (a la race horse) the horse is likely very tensed, and like too low. And if you have tried western gaming exercises you have talk him to 'book' especially on a curved line (ie barrels).

A horse SHOULD chew the bit, but chomping is a sign of tense. Softly chewing and seeking the hand (staying out to it from the soft actions of the supportive leg/seat) is the only way the muscles will be rebuilt correctly.

Is not 'keeping the had down because you want to show' which should concern you, but rather gathering the trust of the horse so it seeks you instead of fleeing the effects of harsher bits by hollowing and fleeing imho. It should be the effects of proper training which are concern, not a bit which will (only momentarily) fix it.

Hopefully are not using the aids actually in the flanks, but a hands with behind the girth with soft pulsations, and NEVER with the leg drawn upward into the belly.

For me, it is start over with proper inhand work, and with a teacher which knows how to guide reschooling and teaches timing of the aids. When doing lateral work remember it is first forward and secondarily sideways, do not just HOLD an aid, but rather allow the horse time to REACT to your action. Likely you let the horse flee the aids, and then try to gather it. Even in transitions the rider must maintain their balance/composure/and the horse's mind.

-- Edited by barnfrog on Monday 18th of July 2011 05:56:48 PM